Response to Noah's Survey

After posting and deleting this several times. I believe now I have it posted on the first page. I felt the need to be a star and be at the top of the page. It is amazing that I actually looked at the posting instructions to finally get it right. Noah, use this how you will, I just wanted everyone to see it. Your survey helped greatly to formulate an opinion.

I believe discussion classes and self-directed learning where my main reasons for attending Shimer. I’ll have to admit the location was rather unappealing as well as living space and lack of amenities. Lack of an arts program was also a pretty big issue.

I initially left Shimer to explore the world a bit more. I also realized that I no longer needed Shimer. I realized that I could learn on my own, which is part of what Shimer is teaching. I returned to Shimer after traveling and moving around a bit in order to finish my degree. I felt that I needed a degree and Shimer was one of the few places I could stomach getting one. During my final year or so I moved to Evanston and commuted. I also spent a semester at Weekend College. Living away from Shimer helped a lot. I found myself able to participate in Chicago’s artistic community and lead a life not so steeped in the small community. I could come back to it refreshed and ready to listen.

It looks like from the above statement I’d be for the move, but I don’t believe I am for it. I am definitely for some physical improvements of the existing college. I think if the College were to go to Chicago I’d rather see it not affiliated with another College. If it had to affiliate with another college to survive I’d like it to be an institution with similar values. I’d like to see Shimer in Chicago or Waukegan with a broadened curriculum, taking other approaches to education that fall in line with dialogue classes and self-directed learning techniques. I’d like to see music, art, performance art, gender studies, global studies, technology and classes concerning political activism added. I believe this would attract more students of differing backgrounds and abilities. Speaking as a bit of an anti-intellectual, I’d like to see less intellectual types attend Shimer. I’d like Shimer to broaden its scope a little whilst maintaining the great books core curriculum.

I see some talk on this blog of Shimer students being a certain ‘type’. And, that somehow ‘other’ types might ruin the experience. I’m more of a mind to share the love. To seek people out who may not be the exact ‘type’ and bring them in to see what they are able to do. I certainly didn’t feel like the typical Shimer student when I attended. I often felt frustrated with the attitudes and intellectual dogma of a great deal of the student body. However, I felt I contributed a lot by being different. Diversity is a beautiful thing.

- Chris Heinisch

The First One to Lose His Temper...

Mr. Dubensky... I applaud your championing the President and the Chairman. I wish I could explain the rest of the lesson to you but I can't. You have to see it happen a few times before you realize we are emotional and intellectual beings. Temper your emotion, yes; lay it aside never. It paints our great chapels and drags us out of concentration camps

So can we get a few people to acknowledge Sara Kimmel, the alumn and the students she spoke to?

Without all of these emotional, over-reactive students and alumn this calm orderly, well mannered dialouge would never have taken place.

As long as people are patting themselves on the back for maintaining their composure and eloquence....

It's about the Ying and the Yang, Ya Know?

Now where were we? Oh yeah, some students asked some questions...

dual diagnosis

I'm one of those rare birds with Mt. Carroll-Waukegan Shimer experience. I will never forget moving the library. It snowed -- a lot that year. (I graduated 1975, taught 1978-80). I also attended an informational meeting at the college 11/27. I am disposed toward the move to Chicago as a means to keep this 152-year-old institution alive because:

-- enrollment has flattened at 110 students. (Don Moon cited this figure at meeting). That's really not a whole lot of people with which to have a college experience nor is it a good way to increase visibility or a base of alumni financial support.

-- the future is not good for liberal arts colleges in general unless they are distinctive, a word Bill Rice used that made sense. Shimer's Great Books curriculum & discussion method is distinctive but it doesn't mean anything if no one knows about it. The pairing of liberal Shimer & techno IIT is unorthodox, which certainly boosts the distinctive factor.

-- most idealistically, Shimer shaped my life forever. I met at Shimer five of my closest friends, whom I have known for more than 30 years. I would like other people to have this unique developmental opportunity, particularly because our country and world need people who know how to think, see interrelationships and analyze. Plus everybody needs loyal friends.

Count me in.

Thank You for Creating a Dialogue

I want to thank President Bill Rice for holding the alum meeting last night and the previous meeting in Evanston. We are a critical and cynical group of students and alums. We are passionate about our education and we have been trained to question and disagree. Unfortunately, one of the negative effects of being taught how to argue is that we develop the tendency to label and treat real people as problems--and even enemies--that a skeptical reader doubts--and even hates. But it's not the person that should be doubted, although the person may appear to be the cause of the problem, but the proposal (which is essentially an argument), the reasons for the proposal, the reasons against the proposal, and the evidence or lack-there-of for the proposal. I know that's a heavy claim, with debatable philosophical and legal implications, which some people will not accept or tolerate, but so be it. This is not at all meant to discourage rigorous debate and discussion, which I strongly promote and believe is necessary for a healthy, strong democracy. I am also very aware that there is a lot at stake with this proposal; the very survival and identity (some people would even go so far as to say "soul") of Shimer College are being gambled with. But I feel that we need to have some respect for the decision-makers and the decision-making process regarding something so huge and complex. Even if you feel that one of the core values of Shimer has been violated, the value of dialogue, which is one of the main selling points of the college, we need to recognize the efforts of the administration to remedy its errors, which I suspect in this case is because we have been offered a deal in the last minute with short notice to act upon it, and include us in the dialogue, even as they work their way through complex territory and issues. Frankly, the whole situation is less than beautiful, and even IIT's approach to Shimer College does not appear to be as generous as I would like it to have been; but Shimer College is a poor liberal arts college, and it simply can't afford to buy a Lexus, when it can barely afford a Honda.

I want to firmly state, even if I lose what few friends I have at Shimer, which is not too many at this point, that I sincerely believe (at least I don't have any reason or evidence to believe otherwise) that the president is doing his job, doing what he is being paid the big bucks for. He has analyzed a complex problem, explored various options, discussed the problem deeply with many smart people, and emerged with a solution. He and the board are now selling us on this proposal; they are trying to persuade us of the benefits of this move. Since there are some genuine benefits, which depends on the individual, such as the location in Chicago, access to pre-med and technology courses, and a stream-lined and simplified operation in which the professors can focus on what they are being paid the-not-so-big bucks to do, I would like to strongly encourage the Shimer community to respect the leadership of Shimer College, who must have put a lot of thought into this proposal. At the end of the day, whether or not the board honors the assembly, and whether or not the board decides to move to Chicago, it is the students who will decide whether they agree with the decison of the board with their purchasing power.

Think about the cost and benefits of the proposal, the pros and cons, the risks and advantages. Think about how you can benefit from this move, whether it is a good feel or fit for you, whether it will meet your needs, whether you can still deeply engage in the great books discussion groups at IIT. And then only you have the final power, the final authority, the final decision of whether you agree or not.


Michael Dubensky '03

If I am being naive about what is going on, and if someone wants to inform me about anything that could change the trust that I have that our leaders are acting in good faith and that their heart is in the right place (i. e., the quality of the education and experience for the students), I can be reached at (312) 217-4503 or mdubensky@earthlink.net.

From Noah: Shimer Survey

Dear fellow Shimerians,

In the process of deciding whether a move (or expansion) at the IIT campus on the South Side would be a good idea for the College, it is important to consider the effect it would have on recruitment and retention of students. I have seen little serious discussion of this nature and much unfounded conjecture. In order to replace this groundless guesswork with guesswork based on some little substance, I’d like to hear from as many current students, former students, graduates and students who left the answers to two sets of questions, and certainly wouldn’t mind hearing from staff, faculty of the present or past:

- What brought you to Shimer initially? What aspects of Shimer made the College appealing, and what aspects made is unappealing?

- What keeps you at Shimer (or made you leave)? What aspects of Shimer are those that draw you in as you live the Shimer life, and what aspects make you want to leave?

Please consider as many aspects of the college as you can, including but not limited to the community, the academics (both the curriculum and the format), the schedule, the location, the amenities and the physical plant.

If you’d forward this to people who you think should be included in this informal study, I’d appreciate it greatly.

Please return your responses with or without your name, but preferably including whether you’re a staff member, faculty member, weekday or weekend student and whether you’re still here or left by graduation, retirement or by your own volition.

If I could get these back in a week or two, that would be awesome. Let’s say the 4^th of December, which is a Sunday of weekend college (and Assembly meeting!). I’ll have some sort of report and summary to the whole community when I can, hopefully with the information provided by David Shiner and the Self-Study group.

Please respond either by email (n.kippleyogman@shimer.edu) or in my box in Prairie.

Thank you very much,

Noah

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Noah Kippley-Ogman

PO Box 500

Waukegan IL 60079

n.kippleyogman@shimer.edu

651.269.7336